Mike and Jim breakdown the Celtics win over the Pacers and look ahead to the tonights game vs. the LA Lakers.
You'll get our candid thoughts on the Lakers' recent stumbles, internal tensions, and the roller-coaster performances of players like D'angelo Russell. We can't help but reminisce about the Celtics-Lakers rivalry from yesteryears, painting a vivid picture of our personal peaks and valleys as fans of this epic sports saga. Nostalgia abounds as we revisit heartbreaks, triumphs, and the unforgettable – like the day Paul Pierce became "The Truth". Join us for a trip down memory lane and a look into the future of these iconic rivals.
Mike and Jim breakdown the Celtics win over the Pacers and look ahead to the tonights game vs. the LA Lakers.
You'll get our candid thoughts on the Lakers' recent stumbles, internal tensions, and the roller-coaster performances of players like D'angelo Russell. We can't help but reminisce about the Celtics-Lakers rivalry from yesteryears, painting a vivid picture of our personal peaks and valleys as fans of this epic sports saga. Nostalgia abounds as we revisit heartbreaks, triumphs, and the unforgettable – like the day Paul Pierce became "The Truth". Join us for a trip down memory lane and a look into the future of these iconic rivals.
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Mike Quigley:They're gonna call it a heartfelt. They're gonna call it a heartfelt, offering in-depth analysis on all things Boston Celtics With your hosts, jim and Mike Quigley. Good morning or good afternoon, depending on when you're listening to it. Another episode of Hard Foul with your hosts, jim Quigley and myself, mike Quigley. Victory coming off of victory against the Indiana Pacers this week, on the second night of a back-to-back where the Celtics, I think you could argue, didn't play their hardest Defensively, gave up a lot of second chance points, but pulled it out in the end with some terrific defensive plays made by Jason Tatum, a first half of really good execution on the offensive end and a second half of kind of walking to the finish line, in my opinion, hoping that you're gonna win the game, jim. Any initial thoughts on the Pacers game that you want to dive into that? We're gonna dive into the rivalry with the LA League as well.
Jim Quigley:Yeah, so it was their 15th game in 26 days, I think it was. Do I have that right? Yeah, I think so. They're 15 games in 26 days, so it's kind of the end of the stretch. I argued with you the last time that I thought the end of the stretch was the end of their road trip, but I think you might be right. There were 11-4 over those 15 games, plus 9 in an average point differential. So they did more than survive a really tough stretch that was littered with a bunch of really good teams and a really tough just travel schedule and rest schedule.
Jim Quigley:And, like you said, second night of the back-to-back, I thought, you know, obviously the offense looked great. In that first half they scored nearly 80 points. They'd scored over 80 points actually, which is just, you know, ridiculous. But, as you mentioned, I think they wanted to have time and they'd given up 22 or 24 seconds, 10 points. And that continued right into the third quarter where there wasn't a commitment on both ends, certainly not a commitment from an effort standpoint on the defensive glass. I thought the pace is just outworked them for three quarters there. And then you know you and I had gone back and forth about just the overall play of the team and in particular, you know, nimas Kata, you know really struggling at points when he was in there. But I have to say, despite his struggles, I thought he was kind of the key that got them going in the fourth quarter from an effort standpoint he, you know, nearly turned the ball over and turned it into a jump ball and kind of had that goofy moment where he tipped it to himself and everyone's kind of looking like what's going on. Well, the next possession he gets on the floor and creates another jump ball to save an offensive possession and tips it to Jaylin who tips it right back to him and he gets the M1. And then he gets extra opportunities for the Celtics with his work on the offensive glass and he was working his tail off on the defensive end and it wasn't always pretty at all. In fact it was very sloppy. But you just saw the fight that he brought at the start that fourth quarter and I thought you know it carried over to his teammates. I thought that energized them to get them going, you know, and they were much better on the defensive glass for the rest of that game. They kind of walked down the lead, like you said at the end of the game and they were able to hold on to win. But if I'm searching for a positive from that game, it was Kader just kind of lighting a fire to get them going, and over a course of 82, you're going to need your bench guys to do that, especially when guys are out like Horford and Cornette. So kudos to him.
Jim Quigley:Certainly wasn't that best night. You did a good job During the game and I don't know if you got in your opening or not, where they once again didn't score 50 points in the second half at home, which has been a trend over the last three games. But they've got through this kind of really tough stretch. I think there's some things we can look at from the team standpoint that are good, some things that are not so good, and they're about to hit a stretch of basketball where they don't play a lot of good teams and the schedule is kind of con to them in terms of rest and travel and things like that. So there's certainly things we can nitpick, but best record in the league by more than three games and they got through a stretch of schedule which could have been a lot worse, out of 11 and four. So, mike, that's kind of my takeaway from the paces win and I know you want to look ahead as well.
Mike Quigley:Yeah, I mean they even increased their lead here in the Eastern Conference during this stretch. I mean they're up five games now on Milwaukee. Milwaukee lost again last night on the road in Portland. So the Celtics are in a really comfortable place, standing wise where in February. Now there's an opportunity to really put some distance between themselves and everybody else, including both conferences, and now putting their eye on the prize of home court advantage throughout the entire playoffs. So that, to me, should be the goal at this point. They've been so good at home this season to stack as many wins as they can here in February, and maybe they can go on cruise control a little bit in April. But even March isn't that difficult of a schedule. So Celtics are in a really good place, I will say, as far as how they're playing on the floor, they are winning games.
Mike Quigley:The second half's are concerning to me. I'm seeing old habits, even some of the turnovers at the end of that Indiana game when the game was over. Now they eight. Second violation on Drew Holiday, followed up by another turnover. These are things we saw last year. These are things that have shown up in the playoffs.
Mike Quigley:The one thing I did like is out of a time out where they were struggling offensively. They went right to the post before Zingas and this match, that was a great inbound play by Missoula, but just the pace of play once again in the second half and the lack of execution, the lack of good three point attempts that are open through ball movement, a lot of one pass and shooting a three. It's just a lack of focus really, and those are the things that they have to improve. Maybe they'll be more mentally fresh during February to get back to those good habits. But that's my focus is looking forward.
Mike Quigley:And speaking of looking forward, the league is on a great team. They're playing horrible. They've lost to the Hawks recently. I think they've lost to Memphis. They only have seven wins on the road. I think their road record is like seven and 17,. One of the worst road records in the NBA. And despite that, it's still a rivalry, jim. And what are your thoughts on tonight's game? And we'll talk a little bit about the history of the Celtics Lakers rivalry, as it's been probably the best rivalry you can argue in all sports.
Jim Quigley:Well, you expected the Lakers to come out and give their best effort. That's what you expect. They're at a really interesting spot. There's a clear dynamic between the best players LeBron and Davis and the coach and the rest of the players. They don't like the coach. I think that's been clear. I mean, they don't really hide it in their comments after games. We talk about Celtics effort.
Jim Quigley:I think there's been a ton of times this season where you could question the Lakers effort out on the court. They are, you know, it seems like this is happening to them every year where they're hovering around 500 at this point of the year. Some seasons they respond like last year, but there's been more seasons than not where they have not and they've ended up under 500 or playing in for the playing game way too often with the talent they have. And this is, I think, a much tougher spot for them to be in than like, even, say, last season, because the talent in the West is just so much better and there's so many good teams out there that if you start digging yourself a hole, it's going to be really hard to get out of. You know, right now they're in a spot where I think they're the 10th seed in the in the West. So they'd be in the play-in game with the, you know, battling out with Utah for the last play-in spot. So this, I imagine, is a really big game for them. I don't know the status of Anthony Davis. I know he didn't play against Atlanta. I think they would need him to have any shot tonight.
Jim Quigley:But you could really go. This is a national TV game against your rival. For them it could go one or two ways right. You could show up and play really well and maybe you can build some momentum on that. But if the Celtics bury them, they're going to be leading every. You know there's no football game this weekend. The Super Bowl's on a bye. They're going to be leaving leading every national sports talk show tomorrow if the Celtics bury them, and Dobbin Ham's job is, you know, going to be under a magnifying glass, if there already is, but it's going to be that much more. You can expect some passive, aggressive comments from the players and maybe even more direct.
Jim Quigley:So this is a really interesting night, I think, for their season. You know you have your rival going in one direction, you're going in another. They already kind of beat you pretty good at home on Christmas Day and now, hey, you got Isara on national TV again, with not a lot else going on in the sports world. If you don't show up, I don't want to say it's this season, but it's getting close to that point, right, it really is. So I just don't know, mike.
Jim Quigley:I don't know what to expect from them. Lebron can clearly still play. He had a triple double the other night. He's still excellent. You know they show that they can turn it on when they have to, like they did with the end season tournament. But they've just been terrible since then, and I, you know it's kind of embarrassing. It gets more and more embarrassing that they put a banner up for that, especially with the way they've played since that point. So that's my evaluation. I know you wanted my expectations for tonight, but you know it's either the best effort, I think they're going to get the doors blown on.
Mike Quigley:Yeah, I'm in the same boat as you and it's interesting. You have LeBron. He's tweeting like running out of time. What does that mean? And is it possible that he's saying like you're going to fire the coach, or is it him hinting at he wants to be traded? I don't know if that is something like that could actually happen, but you really can't count anything out. The NBA and I'm sure a lot of teams would be interested, obviously in seeing if there was a way they could bring him in, but that team is a mess. I mean they were starting Jackson Hayes the other night.
Mike Quigley:The guy keeps switching up his starting lineup. Nothing seems to be working. D'angelo Russell he can't play defense, even though he talks that he wants to play defense like Derrick White that was his quote he can't really defend anybody and offensively he's just average. And then even Austin Reeves, a guy who came to life in the second half last year and really was the man in the playoffs as a third option. They made a run. I don't think he has a place on the team anymore. He still puts up numbers, but I don't think people know what their roles are, and that's good, because I hate the Lakers and I love to see them suffer and, I hope, to self-explode them out tonight. That brings us into the next section. Go ahead.
Jim Quigley:Jim. Yeah, and I was going to say you saw them go with that all defensive lineup against the Celtics last time and they can definitely defend right With Davis and LeBron and Vanderbilt and I forget who they got play was but they just struggled so badly on the offensive end that the Celtics ended up getting easy shots because they were always in transition. Is Gabe Vincent even playing or getting minutes for them right now?
Mike Quigley:He's been hurt, Still hurt yeah. Yeah, it's another one that's backfired for them. I mean, I think everybody could have saw that coming, if I'm going to be honest. But no, I think for a little while we thought that might have been like a good pickup, but it seems like one of those players that's good in Miami isn't going to be good anywhere else.
Jim Quigley:Yeah, yeah, well, they, they. They signed the other way to the Miami Heat. Point out there a couple years ago that never played too. Oh Don, yeah, his name is Chris Don, is that what it was?
Mike Quigley:Kendrick Don or something yeah.
Jim Quigley:A, nun is it nun.
Mike Quigley:Not, not, yeah, it's even in the league.
Jim Quigley:I don't know. So, yeah, you know, in as far as this rivalry goes, obviously a great, great rivalry. There hasn't been a ton of big games lately, over the last you know. You know, since Colton, yeah you know, got close in the bubble, so I think it's lost some of that spice. I mean, lebron brought some of it back. But, yeah, obviously a tremendous rivalry it's. They're an easy team to hate. You know what's funny about it, though, mike, as far as teams I dislike from a fan perspective, I obviously dislike the Lakers, but I've always hated, like Philly more. I can't hate Mike anymore, you know, yeah, I. There are some aspects of the Lakers that I've, you know, begrudgingly respected over the years. So, do you have questions or do you want me to ask?
Mike Quigley:Yeah, if you have some if you have some to OK. I want to start off Tim, like what was the most hot break in moment for you in this rivalry. Oh that's, yeah, no, that's definitely some tough losses over the years.
Jim Quigley:Yeah, so I think I was. I was too young in 87. Although I remember it, but I was too young to have called, really called a hot break, and you know where's. The Celtics were more healthy when they were playing them that year because, you know, just all time great teams, but it would have to be that 2010,.
Jim Quigley:You know, you lose Park in game six with the ACL and then you play just tremendous defense on Kobe in game seven, really shut him down and it was reminiscent of what you saw against the Paces the other night.
Jim Quigley:The Celtics just couldn't get a defensive rebound and they would have these just great, great defensive possessions that were turning to back breaking moments because they couldn't control the rebound. And it just goes to show, you know, your defensive performance doesn't add until you get the ball. And the Celtics didn't have enough offensive punch in that game to overcome that. And Rashid Wallace, you know, gave it his all but he was out of shape and really, you know, wasn't any help on the glass. So, missing Park for that game and Not being able to control a rebound when you, I still look back at that game seven and they clearly played the Lakers in that game seven. They really all played them for the most part, except for that one very huge, important element of a game and to get beat by Ron, our tests, like you did in game seven, to made it hurt even that much worse it did and the fact that they blew a lead in that fourth quarter to the offense was stagnant.
Mike Quigley:They just they had such a hot time scoring against the team that I didn't think was great defensively, but they ended up being really great defensively the Lakers team in that year. One thing that always stood out to me in that series was I think Kobe got MVP because of name recognition, but the MVP of that series was Paul Gasol. He was awesome. Yeah, yeah and it wasn't close.
Jim Quigley:And Odom was really really good too. You know, not on that level, but he really gave them big moments. Yeah Well, Odom did even in the series we won in six.
Mike Quigley:I thought Odom, especially in the first half of the comeback, the year we wanted in the way Odom was like all world when Lakers built that big lead and then eventually blew it because they sucked defensively but yeah, that for me was a great lead Defensively. But yeah, that for me too, that that was the biggest hotbreaker. And it wasn't just run on test three Like Eric Fisher sucked all series and then in that fourth quarter he just started hitting shots and it was such a bullshit Like the Celtics game plan was to not even like cover him in run on tests. They both started hitting shots.
Mike Quigley:It's like and down the other end Paul Pearson, kevin Garnack can't hit anything. And it was like this is, this is this is not an eight, you know.
Jim Quigley:No one else is an underrated moment. You don't think it's hot break at the time. But the 2009 season, the eight, oh nine season after the you know, the championship.
Mike Quigley:The best team in the NBA. Till KG got hurt. Yeah, going into.
Jim Quigley:LA they were 25 and two or something. La, you know, rematch win down there. On Christmas Day. A week later KG hurts his knee and it's just over. You know kind of robbed of another championship matchup of the Lakers and the Celtics and I. That would have been probably a great one. You know the Lakers is kind of you know, easily one against a magic in five or six. But yeah, no, that that's another one that stands out to All right.
Mike Quigley:So, jim, my mind's going to probably be surprising to you, but what's one of like your like I don't want to say like best moment, but like what's one of your most surprising memories of this Rivalry, like something that you didn't expect, and then you're like, wow, that was awesome.
Jim Quigley:No, I don't know. You go first any time to think about it.
Mike Quigley:Well, mine is. So if you go back to like the 0203 yeah, that Celtic's team that lost in the Eastern Conference finals, or it was either that year, the year before back then it would be hard for some reason, to get nationally broadcast games I don't know if we didn't pay enough money on cable, whatever but, um, the Celtics went down the LA and that was the Night that Paul Pierce got the nickname the truth. When he went off down there I didn't see the game and so the next morning, back then it was I Like getting the newspaper. So I remember going over my friend Chris Jakes's house and asking his father like how the game went, because I figured the Celtics were gonna get smoked.
Mike Quigley:I remember him just like giving me the article, like reading it and being like, oh my god, paul Pierce went off. They won. This is so cool, like because we're all like we all like we're hungry for that guy. And I just remember like Thinking like Paul Pierce is the man and I'll like being such a huge fan of his. Then seeing that newspaper article like he went down there and dominated Jack and Kobe was just like really cool. That was just like really cool memory for me.
Jim Quigley:Yeah, I, that was great.
Jim Quigley:It was that the one he nicknamed the truth to after yes, after the game yeah, yeah, I can't think of anything in particular, but you know, this was kind of surprising to me when I so Michael Cooper, the great Lakers defensive player from the 80s, was on a podcast but I heard an old interview or something I forget. But he's just talking about his matchups with bird and he just said you know, the guy was such a son of a bitch. He goes that. You know I'm not there doing a good job, I'm fighting, I'm fighting. And he goes down to the post and he starts yelling to DJ, I'm wide open, no one's covering me, the ball, wide open. You know, that's so disrespectful, it's so disrespectful. Cooper actually always did a good job against him, but it was just shielded. The confidence that you know bird had.
Jim Quigley:And you think about that 87, and you know you go back to that 87 championship series and magic hits, that running hook shot, you know, to give the Lakers the lead After they get. You know they got it blown out the game before and what was called the Boston massacre, and then you know they came all the way back in that game. Then bird, you know they come out of the inbounds play and he gets that Re-pointer from the corner to win the game and it's I mean it's right online and even when you watch it now it's like it's hard to believe it rims out. You know it's like he hits it so often in. When it's in the air it looks perfect and it's still hard to believe it from rims out or if that goes in, it's probably a whole Different series. Right, they probably felt yeah when 87. So you Know, when you talk about surprising moments, that ball not going in in the corner in 87, that's probably the most surprising moment I can think of.
Mike Quigley:Thanks, this is my last question, then if you have any, it's okay if you don't, because I know I didn't let you prepare for this. So we do a great job on the pod, not communicating. So my, my last question is like who is your most hated LA Laker of all time?
Jim Quigley:You go first again, you know.
Mike Quigley:Yeah, this was tough for me, but I do think in the end, like over time, obviously I stopped hating him and respected the greatness of Kobe Bryant. But, going back to the Heart of the rivalry, for me, when these two teams were playing for championships, I hated Kobe. I would try to find every reason why he wasn't good, like I would. I would like dive through whatever I could find to talk shit about him. Obviously, in the end, he was great. There wasn't a lot of things about his game that you could pick at. But I'm didn't play great against the Celtics in either NBA finals. I don't think. I Don't think he played at the level that he did against other teams, especially in the Western Conference, and just like Suffocating them and you know doing the Kobe thing. So I always thought the Celtics played him really tough defensively, especially Ray Allen.
Mike Quigley:But yeah, for me, going back, it was, it was Kobe and I definitely hated Sasha. Yeah, I hated Sasha. I think I called him Sasha. Vagina hit back in the day and I I hated Paul Gasol too. I probably hit the whole team. One guy didn't hate was a maro. I've always loved my.
Jim Quigley:Yeah, yeah, that moment with boots of itch is on the bench, after you know Alan crosses him up and that you know the great, it's great as a game for where the Celtics had that 20-something point come back.
Mike Quigley:It was awesome.
Jim Quigley:Yeah, just like throwing the towel, crying like a baby. That was awesome. I always hated him. I hate so strong words. So I'm having a little bit of a hard time.
Jim Quigley:But one guy I can't stand and because I think he's a quitter is Anthony Davis. I thought he quit in New Orleans on his team with a huge contract to force his way out a year before his contract was even up, to get to LA. And then you know, I watch him there in LA and there's times he's just exceptional and he looks like the best player in the league and he's doing something like 32 points, 24 rebounds and make it look easy. And then there's times you can throw Jalen Brown on him and he disappears. I just he doesn't. I just don't feel like he respects it enough where he gives it as much as he should. And I also can't stand guys that had just quit on teams and try to destroy franchises that you know paying them, that they've committed to, to force their way out of the situation. You know, I think there's other ways to do it, but I just like he bothers me, like James Hartin bothers me. I just I don't think there's a place for it. You know, I know Kevin Durant bounces around from team to team but I've never seen him quit on a team. When he's been there, lebron signs with other teams but he's never quit. He's never, ever quit.
Jim Quigley:Anthony Davis, in my mind, is a quitter and you know, I don't know. That's disrespectful to the game. It's disrespectful to your teammates. Yeah, mike, I don't know what I have for questions. I think we covered it pretty well. Yeah, definitely, you know. The Lakers say they have the same amount of championships, but like how many did they win in Minnesota? I don't know how that carries over, but no one seems to call them out on it. And you know you're not a real. You're not a real like a leaf franchise. If you're raising a banner for the end season tournament either yeah, that was and then you lose like you do. So screw them. I hope the self-explode doors off them, but it's one of those games where it's weird.
Jim Quigley:I expect the Lakers to show up Clearly this means way more to the Lakers than it does to the Celtics.
Mike Quigley:Yeah, I expect the Lakers to show up tonight. Hopefully Anthony Davis plays, we'll see. It's a pretty easy schedule here, jim. Hopefully the Celtics do what they're supposed to do and, like I said here in February, stretch out this lead some more and secure that one seed for the real, the second season, the NBA playoffs. So everybody enjoyed the game tonight, enjoyed the game against Memphis. We'll check in with you guys next week and go Celtics.